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| Dale
Van Blokland - check
out Dale's site on how he painted his Diablo...
I've never painted a car before and it did turn out pretty good. I
figured I saved at least $2500 by doing it myself. Come on, you've done
everything else on the car. Are you going to trust it to some body shop
to meet your high standards?
It really wasn't that hard, by the time you get through priming it three
times, you have mastered the technique. With the new paints, you actually
can apply the 2 base coats and 3 clear coats in one painting as it flashes
dry so quickly. |
Note from Fletch (8/8/05):
If you are looking for all the painting methods and information that Ernie (aka- RacerX) had on this web site, it can be found (soon) in his new book called "The Car Hobbist's Guide To Painting"
When I get more information about Ernies book, I will pass that on.
My thanks goes out to Ernie for sharing his information with the Lounge and best wishes on his new book! |
shaddoe - posted 07 April 2002 05:52 PM
http://www.lambocars.com/framed/diablo/diablo60sei.htm
You can see that the doors were sprayed separate from the car. When you
get into paints with a lot of pearls or metallic it becomes very hard to
spray the doors off the car and get the same color tint. J.C.'s doors are
being painted at the same time as his car but the doors should be standing
up like they would be on the car. The reason that they should be up is because
the pearls and aluminum in the paint will look different the way they lay
down. The colors that Lamborghini makes use a lot of aluminum and pearls,
you can actually feel by the weight of the paint after it is mixed compared
to a solid color.
www.exoticglass1.com
J.C. Hamlin - posted 11 April 2002 06:04 AM
Thanks for the tip. I talked with Ron at SCE and here's a summary of what
he had to say about it.
First, it really depends on the paint.
With pearlized paint you have to assemble the entire car, and paint the
whole thing with continuous strokes (same number of strokes, same direction,
etc). It usually costs about $3000 more to do pearlized paint.
With metallics, it really depends on the paint again. With this particular
paint (which SCE has used many times -- Millennium Metallic) the orientation
of the panels does not matter. What does matter is that all the pieces
are painted in the same batch by the same painter using the same techniques.
You can bet I'll be posting more pictures as the doors, rear bumper, root,
spoiler, and mirrors go on so you can see for yourself.
Happy Painting!
-J.C.
Check out my build site: http://diablo.newmedialabs.net
shaddoe - posted 11 April 2002 07:11 AM
That paint does have a lot of pearls in it. It also has a lot of aluminum
in it. The reason its important to spray at the same time is that differences
in the air pressure and even temperature can make a difference. Good luck,
can't wait to see the finished car as I'm sure everyone is waiting.
www.exoticglass1.com
|
shaddoe
Member posted 29 October 2002 09:57 AM
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http://www.autobodysupply.net/houseofcolor/houseof.htm
I've had emails about different paints and how to use them. This site sells
videos on painying with different paints. One of the most common asked about
is the KAMELEON paint, this site sells the paint and also a video on how
to spray it. The KAMELEON paint is really easy, its the same as a base-coat
clear-coat. The paint job is one of the more expensive parts of your build
and if you can do it yourself you can save a lot of money. If you do good
prep work and set your gun correctly you should be able to paint it yourself,
Dale did his own paint and did a very good job. If you would be interested
in doing it you can buy a cheap gun at LOWES and get some cheap paint to
practice with. If you are thinking about using a CANDY paint I would suggest
doing lots of jobs before trying this because it is the hardest to get a
really good looking job. |
| Dale Van Blokland
Member posted 29 October 2002 10:46 AM
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When my site was changed, I don't think I ever put back the link to the
painting part. You can find it at http://www.lambobuilder.com/paint.html
As Shaddoe said, if the prep is done correctly it will turn out good.
I've never painted a car before and it did turn out pretty good. I figured
I saved at least $2500 by doing it myself. Come on, you've done everything
else on the car. Are you going to trust it to some body shop to meet your
high standards?
It really wasn't that hard, by the time you get through priming it three
times, you have mastered the technique. With the new paints, you actually
can apply the 2 base coats and 3 clear coats in one painting as it flashes
dry so quickly.
|
Graham NV (coming soon)
Member posted 29 October 2002 11:08 AM
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I save alot of money on reupholstering and painting my own vehicles. Luckily
I had some friends that had beaters for me to practice on. When I'm not
so lazy I plan on painting custom harley tanks and selling them. 15 more
projects to finish and I'm there
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84 & 86 Buick T-types
93 Twin Turbo Stealth
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bart_pr_2000
Member posted 29 October 2002 03:45 PM
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the only paint you can apply without a downdraft paint booth is laquer.
if you don't have a booth to suction out the dust in the air it will fall
on your fresh paint and leave a mark. with the laquer you have to rub it
out and most times you will remove the settled dust marks. i have tried
to use an acrylic enamel without the booth and because the paint cannot
be rub out it will leave dust marks. no matter how much you clean the room
the high velocity from the gun stirs up the air and with it the dust.
the filter booth is not only for removing the voc from the air but also
to remove the dust.
This is basic. look at any book on painting
|
shaddoe
Member posted 29 October 2002 05:07 PM
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thats not true because with base-coat clear-coat you can sand and buff the
car after you've painted it. i have also NEVER seen a shop with a down draft
booth that didn't get a little trash in the paint. the only booths you'll
find with no trash are the ones for the major manufacturers which are like
hospital rooms, i doubt you could even find germs in those sealed rooms.
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www.exoticglass1.com
|
Dale Van Blokland
Member posted 29 October 2002 07:01 PM
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I have read numerous paint books and I agree with shaddoe on the sanding.
I painted my car in the garage with a plastic paint booth. Was it ideal,
obviously not but once the base coat is applied, anything that gets into
the clear coat can be sanded out. I did have a few specs that got in but
they were sanded out. with the buffing process, rubbing compound and glazing
compound, you will end up with a mirror finish. My other option was $3-5,000
for someone else to do it. |
CrashRat
Member posted 29 October 2002 07:30 PM
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I've painted several of my own cars and motorcycles using mostly 2 stage
(base coat/clear coat) polyurethanes and a couple 3 stage jobs (pearlescents)
too. My contribution to the discussion would be simply to make sure your
booth is cleaner than clean, has adequate filtered ventilation, thoroughly
clean the car too and paint a few junk panels to test your hand for steadiness.
Personally I wouldn't recommend painting something as important as your
Diablo replica until you've got a few jobs under your belt but look at Dale's
website for an example of what can happen when you're careful and methodical
about it. Looks AWESOME Dale!
Also, my HVLP gun doesn't kick up nearly as much dust as my older non-HVLP
gun (which I still use for primer). And downdraft is cool but like Shaddoe
said I've carefully inspected work from those booths too and you can still
find debri in the finish. Just less of it (usually). You can also use a
base/clear tack cloth to run over the color before you clearcoat, removing
almost every bit of the settled dust before you spray the clear. I've been
very satisfied with my results (especially since I still have the $17k in
my savings account that I didn't spend on a downdraft paint booth!). |
Bob Anderson
Member posted 29 October 2002 09:36 PM
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If you have never painted before, or if you are an expert. Make Darn sure
that you buy a very good Breathing Mask. The base/clear paint has some very
nasty chemicals that are known to cause cancer. No joke, it's very serious.
Saving a few bucks on painting without one isn't worth several years of
life when you die early. I only say this because I have friends who paint
and they don't take this seriously. When you spray paint it atomises in
the air and it goes into your lungs very easily. So, please take care if
you are doing this for the first time.
Also, I have painted very new vehicles outside with base/clear only to have
the wind pick up and leave dust all over. However, after sanding with very
fine paper and polishing the paint looked perfect. In fact it had less orange
peel on it than the parts painted in the factory. Because we sanded them
all out. |
CrashRat
Member posted 29 October 2002 10:40 PM
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Good point, thanks. For the rest of my contribution, I'll punctuate Bob's
reminder about protection. Eye, skin and lung. Catalyzed paints don't play
well with these organs. Well, probably not your stomach or liver either
but if you're gonna be ingesting this stuff then you don't belong in a paintbooth
anyway.
I use rubber gloves, long-sleeve shirts and a face mask (or a paint suit),
goggles while mixing (though some would argue, and wisely, that these should
be worn while spraying too) and a trustworthy respirator. |
CrashRat
Member posted 29 October 2002 10:42 PM
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Wearing goggles while spraying is smart particularly for a novice wanting
to get started because there will be times you get your face too close to
the surface or back in a corner trying to make sure you got good coverage
and you'll pull the trigger only to have the atomized paint reflected back
into your face. |
Countach711
Member posted 29 October 2002 11:30 PM
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I made a $40 fresh-air system, rather than buy a 'cheap' $700 system. There
are iso-cycrnates (or something close to that) in the new paints, in other
words SUPERGLUE!!! ANY quality respirator states plainly on the packaging
that they DO NOT protect you from these type paints. A respirator is the
ONLY thing that will. I bought a $10 dirt devil mini-vacuum cleaner at my
local good-will, found a new-unsed gas mask (missing it's intake filter)
at the local Army-Surplus store for $15, (the complete ones were closer
to $50 I think), then used construction adhesive to attach a vacuum nozzle
to the vaccum and another to the mask, added a $10 hose from the local hardware
store, along with a $2 hose fitting adapter, and PRESTO, a fresh air system
that works great. The only time I've smelled fumes while wearing it is when
I accidently left the garage door open, and fumes came out and got sucked
in the vacuum hanging outside near the door. I don't know about the risks
involved in this type of home-made system, but I'll gladly take my chances
verses a filter that plainly states it WON'T do the job. If anyone wants
(or not) I could post pics for you. I make no guarantees, if you do this,
you are on your own, as I am, it is just an idea I am sharing with others
to do as they choose of their own free will. |
Aviator
Member posted 29 October 2002 11:52 PM
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Bart,
I hate to disagree with you on the theory you offered, but you are wrong!
I know others also mentioned this in previous posts, but what you say is
not true. See, that is the magic of a base-coat / clear coat. Small orange-peel?
Small foreign particles? Sand them out! I hate to sound controversial, but
I have painted many vehicles, and TONS of Cessna aircraft as well (my grandfather
was an authorized Cessna dealer & rebuilder). We always ended-up with
good paint jobs, without all the apparatus you mention as mandatory. Granted,
you may sand your ass off, then sand some more (also as Dale mentions on
his site) but the results can be phenominal versus paying a paint shop to
do it for you.
Aviator |
Jed Copham (No Bull)
Member posted 30 October 2002 06:18 AM
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I'm a mechanical engineer, I love mechanics. Painting? I think I'll pass.
The bit of sculpting of the fiberglass I did will forever linger in my shop
Granted the body work and paint is a 10k deal for a reputible source. But
bang for the buck was worth it in my opinion. Its ok to outsource, you can
still say you built it, just had someone else paint it! |
janice_ho
Member posted 30 October 2002 07:33 AM
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You may find this useless piece of information interesting. I worked with
Chrysler for a number of years. The cars are painted using a charged particle
system. The car is charged either + or - and the paint the opposite. There
is very little over spray and the next car in the line can be painted a
different color and is charged the opposite of the previous car. It is quite
impressive. The orange peel is a chosen feature of all the domestic manufacturers.
Some cars have more, some less. It is not a defect. The custom jobs reduce
the orange peel effect with more paint and sanding the layers.
One more thing, many shops wet the floor to capture the dust, it also makes
cleaning the floor later easier. |
Graham NV (coming soon)
Member posted 30 October 2002 10:19 AM
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Exactly, that is why no cutom paint job, aside from Powdercoating is as
durable as a factory paint job. IMO Ford has the best looking paint quality,
then Dodge, and GM. |
Filip
Member posted 30 October 2002 10:39 AM
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Isn't that charged particle system used on powdercoating as well? I guess
that's what you meant by your post Graham NV. Does anyone have experience
with the cheaper Powdercoating systems (~$150)? You need an oven or UV lamps
to cure it, so it is still an investment, but powdercoating all your smaller
parts would be cool.
Has anyone built their own paint booth, or made a 'converstion' of your
garage out of plastic sheeting?
Countach711, that sounds like a good compromise. Could you post pics
of your project?
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My Page: http://www.statikdesign.com/scratchbuilt/
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Graham NV (coming soon)
Member posted 30 October 2002 11:30 AM
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I have, You have to plastic everything off, especially the ceiling, that
is where the draft from the gun and door will cause dust to fall ( I know,
duh ).
What I did after that was cut to spots in the shape of a U in the front
section, and overlap it with a foot of plastic to prevent drawback, of my
open garage and placed two fans in front of the to create a draft going
out of my garage. It worked good, and as mentioned anything else can get
sanded out.
P.S. You can never have to much light while painting, you may think you
can see good, but wait until you have to be sure you overlapped your last
stroke correctly, not fun with a metallic single stage (very finnicky)
I would recommend always using a 2 stage paint. Most people seem to think
that a 2 stage is more difficault, but really it is easier, just more
time consuming. Either have two guns, or cut the flow back alot for the
clear. Clearcoat can always be built upon in light layers, but spray to
much and you have a run that starts at the back of the car and goes to
the front.
And yes, Powder coating is what I was talking about, you can powdercoat
a coat hanger and bend it afterwards and the paint will not flake off,
amazing. |
Countach711
Member posted 30 October 2002 12:30 PM
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Filip,
thanks for the kind words. Are you talking about this project http://www.geocities.com/countach711
or the home-made respirator, which I plan to post soon. My site is very
out of date, although i haven't made a lot more progress than shown. i also
have a web site called Lambocity.com that i am going to get up and running
soon. Right now it's not much different than the one at Geocities.
John |
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